[WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p122)

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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby RockstarRaccoon » Thu Mar 16, 2017 7:29 am

Siberian Tiger wrote:
RockstarRaccoon wrote:Did you tell him how to replicate it?

You are asking me to replicate the issue as well as provide information on to how to replicate the issue to Scubbo

Oh, sorry, I thought you were them.
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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby RockstarRaccoon » Sun Mar 19, 2017 4:58 am

Sitting down for E1M6...

-- Afterthoughts on E1M5 --
- I'm not sure I found the chest in this level... Then again it was huge...
- The candelabra-chandelier model you used in the café is making a crackling noise, like it's a roaring fire instead of little candles...
- I might be wrong, but I didn't feel like I could've gone for the Museum piece of the disc first. You might wanna look into making it nonlinear like that if you haven't already...
--- Then again, that might get really aggravating, because the first one is a bit hard to find.
- It might've been interesting to pull a brief "defend the bridge" sequence or two at points between buildings. Like, you finish the hotel or something and the radio is like "NAZI attack, go defend the bridge!" but there are only a few of them and then you get back to what you're doing. It might add a sense of urgency to the level, but it might also be aggravating and discourage exploration. Can't say, might want to think about it.


-- E1M6 - RETURN TO TUNIS (AKA, "OK, NOW I FEEL LIKE YOU'RE JUST MAKING UP GERMAN...") --
Shtab! shtab!
- Oh cool, we've come full circle to Map 1. You might wanna re-use a couple more sections, and double-check some of the details at some point, because I feel like they're missing.
- 933, 3228 - I can see this horizon-line very clearly from the room and it looks bad.
- I see that Indiana Jones book... You know, if this is in the cannon of the movies, you might wanna make some wanted posters of him: he hates NAZIs.
- That was a sniper in a hallway... heh
- 1750, 3990 - You should make this a real window! That'd be really cool AND give a sniper-position!
- 1970, 2870 - Door only opens in one direction.
- "Oh look Dead NAZIs... Oh look, guys in black... Hello, who are you? Oh shit you're shooting at me!"
- This Temple outside is pretty open feeling... Looks nice.
- Scorpions: Tiny Hitboxes, huge DPS. Also, hello Powerslave.
- This map is making me long for the too-much-ammo issues of the last one: I keep running out.
- You know, I have a thought that might be able to fix your gun-clutter: some of your guns seem to just be better versions of other ones, like the Trenchgun being a better version of the Browning. You could have the better gun just replace the worse gun...
- Holy shit, giant NAZI.
- What's the point if this room in the back of the pyramid?
- Sprite Artist: The Black-Cloaked guys in this level look like they're firing two double-barreled shotguns at once when they are clearly firing one single-barrel then the other. I can fix that for you if you want.
- 3900, 10700 - Shooting sharks in a barrel! ...Wait, how did they get into this desert??
- *kills guy with flamethrower, looks at his body* "Wow, look at that guy's fuckin' feet... I should've had sex with him instead of killing him. :|"
- The sprite based pillars don't look that good on closer inspection: you might want to consider making them map geometry.
- I just looked around for like, 30 minutes after killing the Flamethrower boss. No idea how to open these gates behind the doors he came out of. Noclipping.
--- Later, while noclipping about the level, I found the switch. Because you view it from the side while trying not to fall into a death pit and don't really look at it, it's really easy to miss.
- This temple CLEARLY would not fit inside that building, unless you wanna add so that I'm going underneath it...
- Ok, got past the rolling ball thing, back to the main *black smoke monster thing* "WOAH! WHAT WAS THAT?!"
- Invisible bridge of faith... Killer golden cup... You love your indiana jones references...
- In the Indiana Jones chasm: There's some sort of graphical error with these 1px tall slots in the walls and I'm not sure why you have these sectors here...
- I'd like to take a moment to note: this level looks really good, and has alot of interesting variation in colors and geometry.
- Also, the traps and puzzling shit reminds me of Hexen at it's best.
- ERRMUGERD. These Scorpions are one of the hardest enemies in the game, because they do incredible DPS and have tiny hitboxes which make them nearly impossible to hit...
- Here's an idea: What if the bats and scorpions jumped back a little at the end of their attack animation? Like a Thrust Thing action to move them away from the player for a moment so they're a little easier to hit and can't attack repeatedly.
- 11900, 15900 - I dunno if this was a one-time glitch, butI just got attacked by a shark that was sitting on this ledge out of the water. Rechecked: the sharks can swim up the wall sometimes.
- I just wanted to note, I really like this giant chasm room with the multiple bridges and doors all over the place. This is cool.

It's late, and I can see there's alot more level to cover, including this mine-cart section. I'm gonna stop for the night and pick up again later. Hope this was helpful. Can't wait for the mine-cart sequence I've seen in the videos of this level.


Current Thoughts:
- This is probably the most aesthetically impressive level yet, and I really like pretty much all of the mapping on it, especially the details, puzzles, and traps.
- This level, especially in that outdoor area, has alot of switches which don't really show you what they're doing. They don't even have a vague HUDMessage like Hexen did. It gets really confusing to figure out where I'm going and why and what's been solved, especially if I miss a switch. You guys need to be more aware of that. I was even a bit sad that I couldn't see some of your doors, because I noticed that the one in the back of the temple was very complex.
- You need to re-do the math on these small monsters, which are too small and low to hit reliably. Holy shit.
- I'm liking the dark priest aesthetics and the sudden inclusion of floating heads, though I'm not sure how the latter fits in here.
- This level has alot of very silly stuff going on, from giant NAZIs to Indiana Jones. Moreso than any other level, I think... It's funny, but I'm not sure how I feel about that.
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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby Tormentor667 » Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:28 am

Improvements added, thanks for the feedback ;)
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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby RockstarRaccoon » Sun Mar 19, 2017 5:43 pm

No problem, this is really cool to play through, and I'd like to help with it. :3

Should I download the new version and look over the improvements, or just finish the level?

Edit: Still giggling at "Schtab! Schtab!"
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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby RockstarRaccoon » Mon Mar 20, 2017 2:34 am

Alright, time to finish C1M6!

Real quick, 2 things I noticed on C1M5
- The exclamation points next to and under the bridge don't go away after you disarm the bomb under said bridge.
- The Tank at the end doesn't actually do anything, and the first time, it took me a while to realize it was even an enemy: I thought I'd glitched the numbers.

==== C1M6 - Underground section ====
- So, while Godmoding my way back, I sat there with the scorpions and the bats and checked their hitboxes: they need to be a few pixels taller.
- I also notice the new models for the pillars to replace the sprites. They look a bit better, but the sprites were taller and I think you've messed with your geometry a bit by doing that, because they looked like support-beams in some places.
- 11170, 18250 - Ok... So the arrow on the ground's clever subtlety is ruined by the unnecessary explanation point.
- Lava is actually far more dense than the human body, so in reality you only sink a slight amount and are set on fire by the intense heat. I know that's a nitpick, but it's one of the things Doom actually had right...
- I'm surprised I didn't have too many problems with the platforming section with the pillars in the lava. I liked the grinder part nearby too...
- Heh, I'm not sure what exactly is happening with the trapped gold pit here, but it sure is a nice bit. Maybe you should add some scarabs so it's clearer, assuming it's a Mummy reference?
- In the lava pillars, on the last go-around, I tried to take a shortcut down through the windows back into the first side of it from the pillar with the gold bar. I don't know why, but I can't make that jump...
- I had alot of trouble with the enemies on the mine-tracks: things are moving fast and they're wielding shotguns... It might be a bit much to throw at the player, but I'd have to test it more...
- In the room with the [artifact], on the metal fences on the sides, you forgot to make them impassible.
- You loaded me up on grenades before the [spoiler] boss, but they don't seem to be useful at all... The weapon which seems to be effective is the shotgun.
- That was a really fun boss battle for a doom game!
- These falling rocks are doing alot of damage to me, right after a boss at low health, and I can't exactly see them coming down...
- Alright... Running out to the end and... WHAT?!
- So... Wait... Did I do something wrong...?
- No... Wait...
- NO FUCKING WAY.

Really enjoyed this game so far guys, really nice work all around. Can't wait to continue in the beta of Chapter 2! :D


After thinking about this level later, I thought it might be more interesting if you added like, a quick smacking sound and a knock-down animation at the end of the level, like BJ's been hit from behind as he runs out into the ambush.


Edit: NEVERMIND!
Couldn't wait. Playing C2M1, or at least the early parts.

==== C2M1: Escape from NOT Castle Wolfenstien (feels like a missed opportunity) ====
- I really like the feel of this introductory cutscene, but it might need a bit more exposition, like a textual recap of the last moment of C1M6, maybe also start the level with the final frames of him killing the guard.
- I like that you have this stealth-heavy level, but it's a bit confusing: the mechanics are unprecedented and unexplained. When can they see me? I'm staring some of them in the face and they can't see me, and others I'm far away but beside and they somehow see me... I feel like this needs a bit more leading up to it.
- I also like how the first ranged weapon you give the player is grenades.
- -3500, 3600 - This fake-door literally leads out to the courtyard you can see through the window where there's no other side. It's very obvious it's fake.
- -1900, 1800 - Cyan door says it requires Red key.
--- Takes Cyan Key anyway
- Heh! Hogan's heroes reference...
- -1300, 1100 - Water cooler doesn't do anything (might be on purpose)
- I feel like these jail doors with the rails should slide instead of swing: that's a Wolfenstein thing...
- -450, 3450 - There is a 3D model of a tree poking through the wall.
--- Rather than making a fake wooded area for the view outside of that stairwell, you should make the outside of the building visible, because it's clear to me that the office area I was just in is right over there, and noclipping reveals another indoor area nearby. I'd even make a wall just beyond that so it's clear that BJ couldn't escape through there, and put 2D-billboard trees just beyond that.
- -1300, 1400 - There's like... a weird poster on the other side of the sign's linedef...
- Only BJ Blazkowitz would bother to steal gold coins while escaping a fucking torture chamber. I'd make a crude joke about the fact that he's Jewish here, but it seems highly inappropriate in a section of a game that is literally referencing the holocaust. XD
- -100, 1980 - Gold door takes a completely different key.
- 330, 850 - Green door says it wants the blue key
- 850, 1090 - Purple switch asking for Yellow key
- 960, 1100 - This 2nd floor switch can be toggled from the first floor.
- Searchlight area: So... Being too close to the search-light will get me seen, but jumping on boxes is fine..?
- Ok... So... Dirty Douglas starts chattering to me over... some radio that I now have...? When I walk outside? I thought the objective was to find a radio somewhere...
- 2370, 50 - Uh... What's with the bridge here? It terminates in this odd place...

Alright, well, I escaped from the military prison (it didn't look like a concentration camp to me), and this seems like a good stopping point. I'll probably pick this up again in a few days, so you'll probably have another commit by then...

Nice work so far though!


One Last Edit:
Priest sprites with single barrel shotguns fired one at a time, because they drop single barreled shotguns, and seem to be discharging one then the other...
ImageImage
ImageImage
You want me to rewrite the decorate too?
Last edited by RockstarRaccoon on Mon Mar 20, 2017 4:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby Ozymandias81 » Mon Mar 20, 2017 9:49 am

Please instead of spoiling all BoA here, post your playtesting things on Realm667...
No worries concerning decorate and all other stuff, I can take care. Going through details now, you can't even imagine how much stuff I have to do.
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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby RockstarRaccoon » Mon Mar 20, 2017 4:04 pm

I can imagine, seeing as I've playtested what's already there and given you a to-do list. That's why I'm offering to redo the way the priest sprites work if you're interested: I already know what to edit and can do it quickly in Slade.

I'll post on Realm667 instead from now on. I didn't know you preferred that. I removed the references to end-of-chapter plot details from my last post for you too. See you around. :3
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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby Ozymandias81 » Mon Mar 20, 2017 4:32 pm

As I said I can do that by myself, just check recently changes from gitrepo.

Also: when you playtest a level always make sure that, if you get a graphical glitch like with portals on C1M5, it could be GZDoom build: test with previous or newer builds, because many issues that you have noticed doesn't happen with recent ones.
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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby RockstarRaccoon » Mon Mar 20, 2017 4:55 pm

Ozymandias81 wrote:Also: when you playtest a level always make sure that, if you get a graphical glitch like with portals on C1M5, it could be GZDoom build: test with previous or newer builds, because many issues that you have noticed doesn't happen with recent ones.

Ah, alright then, I'll be more on top of that: I didn't know that any major change for those was planned for the upcoming version.
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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby Ozymandias81 » Mon Mar 20, 2017 6:08 pm

I didn't say that they were planned, it is simply how BoA development progression comes in life, which follows at least GZDoom builds: we always have to test stuff on most recent builds of GZDoom, and if we notice something that doesn't work properly then we wait 2 o 3 builds... but if an issue doesn't change then we ask on forums for clues (or just point to developers of possible bugs)
For example on c1m5 there isn't that issue with that window at "behind you" room.
Did you understand now?
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Re: [WolfenDoom] Blade of Agony (Behind the scenes video | p

Postby RockstarRaccoon » Wed Mar 22, 2017 1:58 am

I understood before. I meant that I didn't realize that GZ was doing improvements to that section of GZDoom's code.

Anyway, I'm looking at your maps in GZDoomBuilder and noticing some stuff with the Nodebuilder which is probably leading to slowdowns: the nodes are being built with the express idea that the player will be running around in the areas outside of the play area, looking over the tops of buildings, and other things that really don't happen too much in the game. I'm wondering if there's a way to give the nodebuilder hints about where it should optimize for the player being and compensating for the Z-axis stuff...
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