[Added] Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmode

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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby NeuralStunner » Sat Aug 27, 2016 2:17 pm

Alternatively, only display the first message onscreen (per map load), but still log all exceptions to the console. That would be enough for a modder to notice when they open the console to do other things, but not confuse players with arcane error messages once a minute.

A secondary problem is that the messages aren't even that useful. (It doesn't even tell you what script/function is triggering the error.) That's part of the reason it's being called "spam".
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby Zhs2 » Sat Aug 27, 2016 2:22 pm

Some unhelpful advice at this stage: ignoring the problem doesn't really make it go away. Some unhelpful wishful thinking: these are the kinds of old mods that need "Ed the Bat" (or similar community) treatment, although if mentioned old mods don't provide their ACS source they are pretty much SoL.
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby Ed the Bat » Sat Aug 27, 2016 2:45 pm

Oh gosh, I'm actually blushing! I didn't realize my efforts were even so recognied. Thank you! :mrgreen:
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby Yholl » Sat Aug 27, 2016 6:10 pm

Yep, you are correct Graf, this did in fact help me correct some long-standing harmless errors in DRLA! As one of my first mods, I did lots of things wrong, and in a very terrible way (although nowhere near 0.l levels of wtf, heh.) I went through each and every one of these errors and corrected them. Well, at least I hope I got them all, whatever.

The point is that now that I've done that
Now I have a shitton of error messages about things that aren't even bugs, and as far as I know, the messages are enabled by default and can't be disabled.
Anyone who tries to play my mods in the latest devbuilds gets spammed into the dust with pointless messages about things that I can't fix because they aren't bugs.

Disable it by default, and have a console command or a commandline to enable it. I don't know a single person who thought having this aggressive message spam enabled by default was a good idea.
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby TerminusEst13 » Sat Aug 27, 2016 6:19 pm

There's also the fact that as of late times, it being "broken" is not actually broken, and is simply compatibility with another mod.
A practice I and several others have been doing lately is doing ACS checks for items that are present in another mod rather than the current mod, so that special behavior can activate if both have been loaded together.

This isn't just "sloppy modding" this is working against, but also intentional compatibility.
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby Kinsie » Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:43 pm

TerminusEst13 wrote:There's also the fact that as of late times, it being "broken" is not actually broken, and is simply compatibility with another mod.
A practice I and several others have been doing lately is doing ACS checks for items that are present in another mod rather than the current mod, so that special behavior can activate if both have been loaded together.

This isn't just "sloppy modding" this is working against, but also intentional compatibility.
Well, clearly you should just stop being so sloppy and incompetent as to promote clean interoperability between multiple projects. Expandability and community collaboration just isn't in the spirit of Doom! Image
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby Graf Zahl » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:34 am

Tying these messages to the 'developer' CVAR would make sense for sure, there's currently just one little problem here: That CVAR induces an insane amount of worthless message spam because there's only one message level. It'd make sense to have a few more severity levels so that developers can actually USE it. In its current state I consider it useless. Who cares, for example if OpenAL created a 32 or 16 bit mixing buffer, for example?
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby Kinsie » Sun Aug 28, 2016 12:46 am

This is fair. I typically create my own cvar for my mod's debug logs since developer mode is... perhaps less informative than it could be. Having levels between "stone cold silence" and "the garbage collector has been turned off and the lifeboats have all been used up" would be very useful in keeping developers informed while not covering the screen with error messages.
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby Graf Zahl » Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:57 am

Ok, fixed. Users can now set the verbosity of developer mode through the menu and these messages are also subjected to that check.
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby Kinsie » Sun Aug 28, 2016 2:26 am

Thanks, this is a good way to handle the situation.
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby NeuralStunner » Sun Aug 28, 2016 10:11 am

And presumably, a user-level script could check the CVar and output some extra info if it's turned on. Win/win!

Is the error message itself going to be made more descriptive, though? :P
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby D2JK » Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:27 am

I'm not sure if I'm happy with having to choose between "errors" and "warnings"; aren't I potentially missing out on information about occasional problems I might want to fix, unless I regularly go and switch between the message levels?

I didn't care much about the "notifications" level, though, as that information wasn't very interesting for debugging.
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby Accensus » Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:37 am

There's also "Everything".
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Re: Restrict "ACS: I Don't Know What Name Is" error to Devmo

Postby Graf Zahl » Thu Sep 01, 2016 4:37 am

If you are really concerned, leave the setting at warning, although these mostly are about internal problems,not external data, with the single excptions of unknown UDMF properties and empty sprite lumps, both of which are normally no concern for a mapper.

In general I'd recommend:

'off' for users.
'errors' for mappers
'warnings' for programmers
'notifications' when debugging specific issues.

These are also inclusive, i.e. warnings includes errors.
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