Weapon recoil?

Ask about ACS, DECORATE, ZScript, or any other scripting questions here!

Moderator: GZDoom Developers

Forum rules
Before asking on how to use a ZDoom feature, read the ZDoom wiki first. If you still don't understand how to use a feature, then ask here.

Please bear in mind that the people helping you do not automatically know how much you know. You may be asked to upload your project file to look at. Don't be afraid to ask questions about what things mean, but also please be patient with the people trying to help you. (And helpers, please be patient with the person you're trying to help!)

Recoil?

Feels good
18
64%
Makes me seasick
0
No votes
Is pointless and silly
4
14%
Is vital
2
7%
Is fun at first but gets boring quickly
2
7%
Don't care
2
7%
 
Total votes: 28

User avatar
Skelegant
Posts: 1432
Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2014 2:38 am
Preferred Pronouns: She/Her
Location: All over the walls and floor of E2M8

Weapon recoil?

Post by Skelegant »

Gun recoil is something I've been messing around with for ages, but still haven't decided whether or not I like it :D While it can help the weapon feel more powerful, it can make the player feel weaker (and sometimes seasick). I think if recoil is added to the more powerful weapons (rocket launcher, SSG etc) but left out of the weaker ones, it works ok.
Last edited by Skelegant on Sat Oct 28, 2017 12:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
Nevander
Posts: 2254
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2014 11:32 pm

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by Nevander »

I didn't vote because I would say it depends on (a) how it's done and (b) how much recoil. The kind of recoil and pitch changes in Doom 64 for example are great. It's the kind of recoil in something like LegenDoom I'm not a fan of.
User avatar
comet1337
Posts: 876
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2015 3:48 am
Location: elsewhere

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by comet1337 »

subtle recoil is always good
stronger recoil isn't bad either, but should be relatively fast and sharp, but not too strong compared to the firerate (looking at you, D4D plasmagun, vibrating PoS)
lastly there's the question of what kind of recoil
zoom based, pitch changing, player moving with a_recoil, screenshake with a_quake
User avatar
Gutawer
Posts: 469
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 6:01 am
Preferred Pronouns: She/Her

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by Gutawer »

There needs to be a "don't care" option :P. I don't really get bothered by its abscence or its presence, unless its an exaggerated amount.
User avatar
Matt
Posts: 9696
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2004 5:37 pm
Preferred Pronouns: They/Them
Operating System Version (Optional): Debian Bullseye
Location: Gotham City SAR, Wyld-Lands of the Lotus People, Dominionist PetroConfederacy of Saudi Canadia
Contact:

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by Matt »

What kind of recoil?

- muzzle climb that temporarily raises your pitch
- muzzle climb that permanently raises your pitch, i.e., you have to manually move your view back down
- the above, with or without an aiming deadzone (which granted is unworkable in GZDoom multiplayer anyway because movement prediction will wreck it like nothing else)

- temporary change of fov

- effect on gun sprite (cf. vanilla pistol, RL, plasma and BFG compared to shotgun and chaingun)

- moving the player backwards (terribly silly for anything but the biggest weapons)
- causing damage to the player and occasionally forcing them to drop the weapon (see above parenthetical)
User avatar
ReX
Posts: 1578
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 10:01 am
Location: Quatto's Palace
Contact:

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by ReX »

Weapon recoil is one of several elements that can enhance (or detract from) gameplay, depending on how it’s implemented. Much like weapon-reload, which some people detest and some people swear by, recoil can introduce a factor to which the player must adjust during combat. Personally, I actually like it in the context of games like Quake and Half-Life. In DooM I quite like things the way they are.
User avatar
comet1337
Posts: 876
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2015 3:48 am
Location: elsewhere

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by comet1337 »

Matt wrote:What kind of recoil?

- muzzle climb that temporarily raises your pitch
quake 2 machinegun, you were the worst
want to hit something? pull your mouse back
stopped shooting? behold our wonderful floor textures
User avatar
Matt
Posts: 9696
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2004 5:37 pm
Preferred Pronouns: They/Them
Operating System Version (Optional): Debian Bullseye
Location: Gotham City SAR, Wyld-Lands of the Lotus People, Dominionist PetroConfederacy of Saudi Canadia
Contact:

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by Matt »

Q2MG would be permanent raising - temporary is more like what you see in a lot of GZDoom weapon mods nowadays.

It was also ridiculously overdone for the amount of damage that stupid little peashooter did and even that wouldn't be so bad if it had been the only thing throwing off your aim rather than it being in addition to a shotgun-like spread that also affected your first shot!

(Psychologically it might also have been more manageable if other guns were subject to the same sort of muzzle climb to a lesser degree...)
ZippeyKeys12
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:49 pm

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by ZippeyKeys12 »

Do you guys feel that temporary pitch and fov change together is a bit too much for a general weapon(rifle, shotgun)?
Because I don't want to give people migraines.
User avatar
Matt
Posts: 9696
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2004 5:37 pm
Preferred Pronouns: They/Them
Operating System Version (Optional): Debian Bullseye
Location: Gotham City SAR, Wyld-Lands of the Lotus People, Dominionist PetroConfederacy of Saudi Canadia
Contact:

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by Matt »

How many shots does it take to kill a typical monster? The perceived power and annoyingness of effects should be scaled according to its use.
User avatar
FFFFRRRR
Posts: 99
Joined: Sat Nov 04, 2017 3:33 am

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by FFFFRRRR »

Personally, I don't need a lot of recoil in Doom. It isn't required to make a fun weapon for such a simple game.
Though I don't mind it. When it maks a weapon feel powerful and reasonably beefy, that's nice. Whether I enjoy permanent Pitch-Changes depends on the gun. If the gun is powerful, and that is its disadvantage, its fine.

With that said, you can make recoil a major part of the gameplay. A good example for that is CS:GO. To make that really work in Doom, you'd just need Hitboxes, so that the player could get rewarded for recoil-control and precise aim. Because recoil throwing off your aim would not make sense when enemies are large (Arachnotron, Baron, Demon...) and it doesn't matter where you hit them. At when very-long-range combat isn't a thing.
User avatar
Matt
Posts: 9696
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2004 5:37 pm
Preferred Pronouns: They/Them
Operating System Version (Optional): Debian Bullseye
Location: Gotham City SAR, Wyld-Lands of the Lotus People, Dominionist PetroConfederacy of Saudi Canadia
Contact:

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by Matt »

Arachnotrons in particular are very often placed for long-range engagements.
User avatar
Skelegant
Posts: 1432
Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2014 2:38 am
Preferred Pronouns: She/Her
Location: All over the walls and floor of E2M8

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by Skelegant »

ZippeyKeys12 wrote:Do you guys feel that temporary pitch and fov change together is a bit too much for a general weapon(rifle, shotgun)?
Because I don't want to give people migraines.
I think that works well for a powerful weapon with a longish loading time (like the SSG), but if someone's sensitive to that kind of thing, then a pitch/fov changing AA12 would probably give them a cranial hernia
ZippeyKeys12
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:49 pm

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by ZippeyKeys12 »

Thanks guys, I think I'm going to reserve it for medium tier weapons and add an option to disable the fov changes as it doesn't really affect gameplay compared to the temporary pitch change.
User avatar
Hexereticdoom
Posts: 652
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2013 1:30 pm
Graphics Processor: nVidia with Vulkan support
Location: Spain
Contact:

Re: Weapon recoil?

Post by Hexereticdoom »

I personally like a lot most of weapons with recoil, as long as it's not too excessive and make just temporal changes to the player's pitch.

On the other hand, I HATE all those weapons that deviates permanently the player's centered view when are shot repeatedly, forcing you to use always the 'center view' key after using them. >:(

I guess it's a matter of taste of each player, after all...
Post Reply

Return to “Scripting”