Can Quake "Bunny Hop" experts please help me?

If it's not ZDoom, it goes here.
SouthernLion
Posts: 776
Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2013 6:45 pm

Can Quake "Bunny Hop" experts please help me?

Post by SouthernLion »

Hi, I'm thinking about making some videos of me playing through classic Quake maps (like that one that was shared in the other thread), and I realized I am an absolute joke at Bunny Hopping. I don't need to be Quake Done Quick speed runner good, but I feel like an idiot trying to do it right. I'm pretty decent at strafe jumping in Quake III: Arena, and Quake Champions, so I don't understand why this is so hard? Isn't it just strafe jumping without the forward key? Although, when I strafe jump, I don't hold space bar, I press it on land. I wonder if that's throwing everything off for me? In Quake III: Arena "Instagib Freezetag" I could make some pretty awesome gap jumps with strafe jumping. I made a video of me strafe jumping in Quake Champions contrasted to me struggling with the bunny hop in Quake 1. You can see my movement speed in both games, in Quake Champions below the crosshair (310 max speed running for my character, I hit over 700 strafe jumping) and in Quake 1 on the bottom right corner (320 max speed running forward, I can barely hit 390-410.) I know they are different units of measurement and are not comparable, but my point is that on the bunny hopping tutorial jumping video the guy goes 5-600 speed in Quake 1 from the second he starts bunny hopping until the second he stops and I feel like I'm going at a snail's pace and would be better off just running on the ground. What am I doing wrong?

(Video recorded in 3840x2160 and downscaled to 1920x1080.)

User avatar
leileilol
Posts: 4427
Joined: Sun May 30, 2004 10:16 am
Location: GNU/Hell

Re: Can Quake "Bunny Hop" experts please help me?

Post by leileilol »

The way Quake's jumping works is generally this:

- Jump button is pressed, a flag is set while the button is pressed when you jump. Holding this button down doesn't allow another jump when you hit the ground. (i.e. "don't pogo stick")
- Depressing this button undoes this flag. Pressing it again and holding will prime the next time you touch the ground to become an immediate jump so you don't take in any of the player physics friction of being on ground.

Quake also calculates extra momentum for diagonal/strafing movements and up slopes as an oversight than anything else. Like doom bugs with wall running etc, it's legacy bugs all those players want as a bare minimum (and the vocal loud players will hate any more 'correct' physics in other games because these buggy speed tricks won't work). This also differs among licensees. If you want an extreme case, play Hexen II. :P Just imagine Quakeguy's feet as one big skateboard when jump is held+repressed+held. Ollie and kick the slopes if you can..

also remember that none of this is "carmack's vision". Some might mention this to justify how quake's all about bad physics and nothing about being a technical landmark. If there's anyone that was for this crap at id, it's zoid, and carmack definitely conflicted with zoid during quake2 post development


I probably worded this badly. hope this helps. I should also mention i'm not a chronic bunnyhopper either and don't like how broken physics + control metagame caused a gatekeeping divide killing off the casual scene. Quake multiplayer games usually had a cycle where they're best enjoyed while new and fresh and "too slow"...
SouthernLion
Posts: 776
Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2013 6:45 pm

Re: Can Quake "Bunny Hop" experts please help me?

Post by SouthernLion »

Thank you for the info, friend. I remember hearing about Carmack not being a fan of the exploit, but I mean.. it's the way he programs that causes this stuff. lol. Same with Commander Keen and the "Impossible Pogo Trick."

Personally, I love it. There's something very satisfying about the fluid motion of strafe jumping and bunny hopping. If I want slow boring "realistic" battles, I'll play Halo, Battlefield or Call of Duty. I play Quake when I'm craving something more.
User avatar
wildweasel
Moderator Team Lead
Posts: 21362
Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2003 7:33 pm

Re: Can Quake "Bunny Hop" experts please help me?

Post by wildweasel »

SouthernLion wrote:Personally, I love it. There's something very satisfying about the fluid motion of strafe jumping and bunny hopping. If I want slow boring "realistic" battles, I'll play Halo, Battlefield or Call of Duty.

And I mean, it's not like bunny-hopping wasn't a valid war-time strategy ;)
User avatar
Gollgagh
Posts: 198
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:24 am

Re: Can Quake "Bunny Hop" experts please help me?

Post by Gollgagh »

If you still needed a primer for strafe jumping, this video relies a little more on details than other intuitive descriptions.

NeuralStunner
 
 
Posts: 12295
Joined: Tue Jul 21, 2009 12:04 pm
Discord: NeuralStunner#4201
Operating System: Windows Vista/7/2008 64-bit
Graphics Processor: nVidia (Modern GZDoom)
Location: capital N, capital S, no space

Re: Can Quake "Bunny Hop" experts please help me?

Post by NeuralStunner »

SouthernLion wrote:Same with Commander Keen and the "Impossible Pogo Trick."
I don't recall if this even worked in the original trilogy, but from 4 on it was both well known (it's described in the game help) and expected for a number of secrets.

As far as Quake bunnyhopping goes: I've primarily encountered it in speedruns and I find it nauseating. I'd rather watch a more entertaining run with a "worse" time. Although from a gameplay perspective, it can be useful combined with straferunning to cross large stretches of cleared map.
SouthernLion
Posts: 776
Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2013 6:45 pm

Re: Can Quake "Bunny Hop" experts please help me?

Post by SouthernLion »

NeuralStunner wrote:
SouthernLion wrote:Same with Commander Keen and the "Impossible Pogo Trick."
I don't recall if this even worked in the original trilogy, but from 4 on it was both well known (it's described in the game help) and expected for a number of secrets.

As far as Quake bunnyhopping goes: I've primarily encountered it in speedruns and I find it nauseating. I'd rather watch a more entertaining run with a "worse" time. Although from a gameplay perspective, it can be useful combined with straferunning to cross large stretches of cleared map.


I believe by 4 they knew about it and made secrets that required it. But my understanding is that in 1-3 it was originally a glitch from Carmack's programming (just like wall running and strafing being faster in Doom and Bunny Hopping / Strafe Jumping in these games.)

Return to “Off-Topic”