Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Cacodemon345 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 5:51 am

leodoom85 wrote:
Cacodemon345 wrote:Those "tiny niche of users" would then switch over to that. People will obviously have to cope up with new OS as it is inevitable.

No. That assumption of yours is so wrong that I'll say this. Currently, I'm using Win 7 and I won't change to any OS by being obligated to do so.....
I was referring to the people who use Linux programs on Android, not ones who doesn't use Linux at all.....
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Graf Zahl » Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:04 am

So you are talking about a niche in a niche and generalize from there...
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Graf Zahl » Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:06 am

leodoom85 wrote:No. That assumption of yours is so wrong that I'll say this. Currently, I'm using Win 7 and I won't change to any OS by being obligated to do so.....


Even when in 5 years, 7 will go the same way as XP is doing now?
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Cacodemon345 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:12 am

Keeping on using an old OS for a long time, even after the support ends for it is harmful. Once you buy a new PC after about two years has passed, you will be obligated to switch to Win10 anyway...
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Kinsie » Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:37 am

Cacodemon345 wrote:Actually, such kind of moves are going to hit Apple, if you combine it with the removal of x86 support. Emulating x86 processor on an ARM is a near-impossible task, as x86 is supermassive CISC and ARM is RISC instruction set. They're even trying to shove iOS into a laptop! I can say that they are definitely going to shoot themselves in the foot. They will have to make developers rewrite everything for their new ARM MacOS. It feels like Apple is going back to it's MacOS days, when you couldn't run Windows software on their computers.
Apple has a long and storied history of not giving a Sunday fuck about backwards compatibility. Once they move to a new processor architecture, they'll update XCode to export binaries for both architectures as "Universal Apps" and slowly discontinue support for the old architecture, just like with the move from PowerPC to Intel.

Also, they've been pretty clear about not merging iOS and macOS (or putting iOS on a laptop or whatever), because touching a laptop screen constantly tires your arm out. (They are, however, porting iOS-centric APIs to MacOS to make it easier to port software from one platform to another, presumably to try and bolster the, uh, unfortunate state of the Mac App Store)
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Cacodemon345 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:43 am

Updating XCode just to export everything? Requires time and effort on costly, commercial programs. Anything simple is easily done. It isn't going to be that easy to export binaries out for ARM. And even then they're going to have less performance and are going to lose out the advantages the x86 had and end up fucking themselves up. In case of PowerPC, there was Rossetta to take care of them. But there's going to be no emulator, and it will take time and effort for porting programs to ARM. GZDoom might even discontinue support for MacOS.
https://9to5mac.com/2018/05/25/apple-project-star-arm-details/
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Rachael » Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:54 am

Cacodemon345 wrote:But there's going to be no emulator, and it will take time and effort for porting programs to ARM. GZDoom might even discontinue support for MacOS.

Could you please bother doing your research? There already exist machine translators that can translate x86 and x86_64 code to ARM, and they do it VERY well, through dynamic binary translation - similar to what Rosetta did.

The problem is that they went from a mediocre architecture (Motorolla), to a good one (PowerPC), to a shit one (x86), to a really good one (x86_64), and now to one that was pretty much meant exclusively for pocket devices (ARM). That's the insanity of it.
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Cacodemon345 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:58 am

I said "GZDoom might discontinue support for MacOS" in the sense that the OpenGL support might be removed in the future. ARM wasn't meant for something like desktop or anything like that, that's the problem here. I'm yet to see a ARM emulator that's able to emulate an Android device without relying on ARM runtime stuff in x86 userspace, like what is being done eith BlueStacks. I tried to open up an ARM Android emulator in Android Studio, and it lagged like hell.
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Rachael » Tue Jun 05, 2018 7:02 am

You missed the entire point of my post.

Oh - and to add to this fuckery...
Cacodemon345 wrote:Keeping on using an old OS for a long time, even after the support ends for it is harmful. Once you buy a new PC after about two years has passed, you will be obligated to switch to Win10 anyway...

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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Graf Zahl » Tue Jun 05, 2018 7:25 am

If Apple really transitions to ARM I'd guess it will kill off a significant chunk of development for sheer lack of processing power. That is, unless they pull a miracle out of their hat and make ARM fast. But even then, they have destroyed so much developer goodwill over the years that a good sized portion will just say a wholehearted "fuck you!" to them and leave for good.

The current Apple management really seems to think that being king of the profit hill essentially means they can dictate where things are heading, but they completely forget that on the desktop they are a minority platform whose only reason for continued existence is iOS development. So what will this end up? Increase of compile times by a factor of 3? I know that for me this will mean I'd sit idle for half of the time each working day essentially, just waiting for that blasted computer to do its job. At some point even the most engaged iOS developers will have to rethink their strategy then.
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Rachael » Tue Jun 05, 2018 7:33 am

They're planning to do it, and their excuse is "Intel isn't going anywhere."

.... really? Where the fuck is Intel supposed to go?
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby leodoom85 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 7:34 am

Graf Zahl wrote:Even when in 5 years, 7 will go the same way as XP is doing now?

Yeah, pretty much. Then I may get forced to changed or before that time, my friend :)
And with this, I'll step aside in this thread.
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Cacodemon345 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 7:41 am

Rachael wrote:They're planning to do it, and their excuse is "Intel isn't going anywhere."

.... really? Where the fuck is Intel supposed to go?

I have no idea where the fuck Apple is actually planning to go. Their excuse: "Intel isn't going anywhere, so we want to increase battery life 'cause our aim is to allow even more apps into our store."
... really? They're even conscious? They wouldn't abandon x86-64 if they were conscious. Increasing battery life isn't everything.
Apple's going to hit themselves very hard.
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Arctangent » Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:03 am

Graf Zahl wrote:
leodoom85 wrote:No. That assumption of yours is so wrong that I'll say this. Currently, I'm using Win 7 and I won't change to any OS by being obligated to do so.....


Even when in 5 years, 7 will go the same way as XP is doing now?

I get the feeling you meant lack of support and continuously decaying security, but then I look at the fact that XP is still probably the most prevalent operating system in a business setting, and, well ..
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Re: Microsoft + Github Acquisition (Rumors)

Postby Rachael » Tue Jun 05, 2018 8:05 am

Arctangent wrote:I get the feeling you meant lack of support and continuously decaying security, but then I look at the fact that XP is still probably the most prevalent operating system in a business setting, and, well ..

Reading that made me giggle. Don't ask why. :mrgreen:

Remember: There's a major security breach almost at least every year from some major firm.
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