Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby RexS » Wed May 30, 2018 8:21 pm

An assault rifle is a smaller handheld rifle that fires a smaller intermediary cartridge, with a detachable magazine, and it has to be capable of selective fire. (SAFE/SEMI/BURST or SAFE/SEMI/AUTO.) The full sized "battle rifles" used in World War II had lots of recoil, and the rounds were designed to have power much farther than was typically seen in combat, making it practically overkill. The Nazis invented the first assault rifle with the Sturmgewehr 44 ("storm gun", or "assault gun/rifle") with smaller intermediate cartridges that allowed more accurate grouping with multiple shots with less recoil than a full rifle cartridge, while still being deadly at the range that most firefights happen in theaters of war. The Soviets were so impressed with the StG 44 from Germany, that they ended up developing (eventually) their own assault rifle with the AK-47 and all subsequent evolutions of the AK-pattern weapons. America decided to follow suit for the same reason, contracting the AR-15 in to a selective fire military assault rifle in Vietnam as the M16 and the smaller 5.56x45mm NATO (or possibly they started with the .223 Remington) cartridge. The first M16 had tons of problems, including jamming after getting a little dirty, which was getting a lot of our troops killed. That's why later variants added the forward assist to help force the bolt closed if some dirt or mud got in it. We still use AR-15 platform weapons in the military today, largely in the form of the modern M4 Carbine (a carbine is like a shorter rifle) which has burst fire as the 3rd option instead of fully automatic, although many branches use the M16 A2 or A3 which is largely improved on from the original model we used in Vietnam. (You still want to keep it clean, the best you can, though.)

So, the short answer: An assault rifle is a selective fire rifle with a smaller intermediary cartridge (smaller than a full rifle round, but bigger than a pistol round) with a detachable magazine.

Machine guns are a different beast from battle rifles or assault rifles, and are designed for sustained fire, often for reasons of suppressing the enemy. They are often (but not always) belt fed instead of magazine fed, and have an open bolt instead of a closed bolt (literally almost every other kind of small arms is closed bolt.) Some can have barrels quickly changed for intense firefights to allow one to cool down. They are often fired from a bipod layed on the ground. The US Government refers to *ALL* automatic or burstfire weapons as "machine guns" in legality, but that is technically incorrect. But it's important to note that for legal purposes in this country. If I rigged my double barrel shotgun to fire both barrels with one trigger pull (not needing a second trigger), it would instantly be an illegal "machine gun", even though that doesn't make sense in technical context.

Submachine guns are automatic weapons that fire pistol cartridges instead of rifle cartridges. And a machine pistol is basically just a fully automatic actual pistol (like if you had a Glock that could fire fully automatic.)
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby Graaicko » Wed May 30, 2018 11:39 pm

Here is a fun little fact: Most people think that AR in (AR-15) means assault rifle, but it actaully means Armalite, the name of the company.
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby RexS » Fri Jun 01, 2018 4:29 pm

Graaicko wrote:Here is a fun little fact: Most people think that AR in (AR-15) means assault rifle, but it actaully means Armalite, the name of the company.


Yep. 100% correct. The only gun that I know if that is *actually* called an assault rifle BY NAME, is the aforementioned Sturmgewehr 44.
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby GAA1992 » Fri Jun 01, 2018 5:24 pm

Which is my favorite gun of them all. It's a piece of beauty.

My favorite is still the "Horn" prototype, i don't know why.

HUGE IMAGE WARNING, spoilered.

Spoiler:
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby phantombeta » Fri Jun 01, 2018 6:02 pm

I don't have any guns, myself, but I wish I could have some. Sadly, I'm a minor, and I live in Brazil, anyway, so even if I weren't a minor I wouldn't be able to own a gun. :\

If I could have guns, though, I'd definitely have a Mateba Model 6 Unica Autorevolver. It's just such a beautiful gun.


I'd also love to have a Karabiner 98k.
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby Graaicko » Fri Jun 01, 2018 7:57 pm

phantombeta wrote:If I could have guns, though, I'd definitely have a Mateba Model 6 Unica Autorevolver. It's just such a beautiful gun.


Yeah That's one handgun I wish I had, It want the aftermarket compensator on it, so sexy.
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby chronoteeth » Sat Jun 02, 2018 12:13 am

i love guns
i have 6 guns

i hate and dispise gun culture
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby Graaicko » Sat Jun 02, 2018 3:41 am

chronoteeth wrote:i hate and dispise gun culture


Wut?????
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby GAA1992 » Sat Jun 02, 2018 4:10 pm

I think he likes to have a gun, but hates the culture of collecting and... er... well, i couldn't get it too.
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby Reactor » Sat Jun 02, 2018 8:02 pm

Once again, RexS, you really outdone yourself when explaining these gun-oddities for us :) It was a tad difficult to follow, but eventually it became all clear :) And yes, I also thought that the "AR" is short for "Assault rifle", this is why I mentioned this distinctly at the SPAR that it's not an assault rifle. Damn video-game logic defies reality!

So these are the key differences between a machinegun and an assault rifle. What about autoguns? I met this title at Realm-667 first, but since I've actually seen it many other places. An autogun is a machinegun or an assault rifle? Or perhaps neither?
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby RexS » Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:49 pm

Reactor wrote:Once again, RexS, you really outdone yourself when explaining these gun-oddities for us :) It was a tad difficult to follow, but eventually it became all clear :) And yes, I also thought that the "AR" is short for "Assault rifle", this is why I mentioned this distinctly at the SPAR that it's not an assault rifle. Damn video-game logic defies reality!

So these are the key differences between a machinegun and an assault rifle. What about autoguns? I met this title at Realm-667 first, but since I've actually seen it many other places. An autogun is a machinegun or an assault rifle? Or perhaps neither?


Why thank you, sir. lol.

I'm not sure if "auto gun" is an actual technical terminology, but just shorthand slang. I've actually heard semi-automatic pistols referred to as "auto pistols", to distinguish them from revolvers and manual actions like pump shotguns since it "automatically loads" (and automatically cocks the hammer on a single action or single/double action.) Which I guess makes it even more confusing since it's semi-automatic and not fully-automatic. But I guess semi-automatic DOES have the word "auto" IN it.. lol
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby NeuralStunner » Sun Jun 03, 2018 6:04 pm

All the real firearms I have any interest in owning are old ones.

Winchester Lever-action rifle
Colt Single-Action Army
The Boomstick (Interestingly, the other two guns also appear in this film. I suppose I'll have to watch it some time.)
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby RexS » Sun Jun 17, 2018 10:03 pm

Guys, don't test your laser sight beams after installing new batteries in the same room as a cat. LMFAO!
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby Fisk » Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:46 am

Hope this doesn't come off as antagonizing, just a few additions

RexS wrote:The first M16 had tons of problems, including jamming after getting a little dirty, which was getting a lot of our troops killed.

Reports also suggest that the early three-prong hider used on early M16s were "chipping" bullets as they left the barrel, which would occasionally cause a round to randomly diverge from the line of aim. M14s allegedly had a similar problem very early in production and a lot of people hated both weapons

We still use AR-15 platform weapons in the military today, largely in the form of the modern M4 Carbine (a carbine is like a shorter rifle) which has burst fire as the 3rd option instead of fully automatic, although many branches use the M16 A2 or A3 which is largely improved on from the original model we used in Vietnam. (You still want to keep it clean, the best you can, though.)


These statements generally portray reality correctly, but two modifications: recently the USMC announced they are moving all Marines to the M27 IAR (essentially an open-or-closed bolt variant of the HK416) which has an S-1-A group, and more often than not you will find M4s in service with S-1-A trigger groups as well.

I had my suspicions from the beginning that replacing the M249 with the M27 was their way of wedging the 416 in as their primary service rifle but the Corps basically sealed the deal for me: http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2018 ... -overhaul/

By the way, fun fact of the now: the reason you will often see AK variants with S-A-1 groups instead of S-1-A like you may be used to on western weapons is because Soviet military doctrine during the era when the AK47 was originally developed considered the rifle the same as a submachine gun and soldiers in that era were trained as such. In other words, during the early days of the AK47's service life, soldiers were trained to use it like a submachine gun and to engage with the AK in CQC ranges in full-auto
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Re: Who here likes guns? I mean really likes guns?

Postby RexS » Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:13 pm

All good information!
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