GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby Graf Zahl » Wed May 03, 2017 2:59 am

Yes, and as I said, the entire scaling stuff was redone, cleaned up and consolidated, because it was so massively screwed up.
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby Chris » Wed May 03, 2017 6:15 am

hitmanx wrote:I came here to report the exact same thing. That and there doesn't seem to be hrtf with openAL, in the advanced options I turned it on but it didn't seem to do anything, neither does sample rate.

Windows's audio system doesn't allow apps to change the device's sample rate, and it won't resample on behalf of the app, so it's unfortunately stuck with using whatever the device is configured for. There may be plugins that allow Windows to do resampling, but I'm not familiar with Windows' audio ecosystem.

For HRTF, I'd need to know if the OpenAL DLL was compiled with support for built-in HRTF data sets or not. If not, you'll need one or two external files for it. If it was, something else may be preventing it from being enabled.
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby Graf Zahl » Wed May 03, 2017 7:21 am

Chris wrote:Windows's audio system doesn't allow apps to change the device's sample rate


And it should be noted that this is a necessity for a system that allows mixing the sound input from multiple apps.
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby dpJudas » Wed May 03, 2017 12:44 pm

An application can open a device in exclusive mode. That will allow you to specify whatever sample rate supported, but such a thing has the side effect of shutting out any other application from producing sound for that device. If that solves the problem then this should only be done if the user allows it - I like playing Doom while listening to music played by other apps.
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby Graf Zahl » Wed May 03, 2017 12:55 pm

I don't think that's possible on modern Windows systems anymore. Wasn't that the main reason they changed their entire audio stack in Vista?
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby Caligari87 » Wed May 03, 2017 12:56 pm

Just checked, my audio devices in Windows 10 have checkboxes for "Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device" and "Give exclusive mode applications priority." Not sure if that means anything in the context you're discussing.

8-)
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby Graf Zahl » Wed May 03, 2017 1:23 pm

It means that it allows you to change the default. On the other hand: What was the last time you experienced some app taking exclusive control over the sound output? For me it's been a long time and I'd immediately notice because I nearly constantly have music playing from my ripped CD collection.

I think you need some really old, really bad DirectSound implementation to achieve that.
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby dpJudas » Wed May 03, 2017 2:31 pm

Graf Zahl wrote:I don't think that's possible on modern Windows systems anymore. Wasn't that the main reason they changed their entire audio stack in Vista?

No, they rewrote their entire audio stack because Microsoft loves rewriting things. :mrgreen: (actually don't know what was wrong with the old stack)

The API introduced in Vista does have exclusive mode - notice the first argument passed into IAudioClient::Initialize. It can be set to either AUDCLNT_SHAREMODE_EXCLUSIVE or AUDCLNT_SHAREMODE_SHARED.

It does come with one important detail: It returns AUDCLNT_E_DEVICE_IN_USE if: "The endpoint device is already in use. Either the device is being used in exclusive mode, or the device is being used in shared mode and the caller asked to use the device in exclusive mode".
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby Graf Zahl » Wed May 03, 2017 3:02 pm

dpJudas wrote:No, they rewrote their entire audio stack because Microsoft loves rewriting things. :mrgreen: (actually don't know what was wrong with the old stack)


There were certainly things wrong with it. Sharing audio output on XP was a hit-and-miss affair because the 'direct' aspect of DirectSound made proper sharing close to impossible.

It does come with one important detail: It returns AUDCLNT_E_DEVICE_IN_USE if: "The endpoint device is already in use. Either the device is being used in exclusive mode, or the device is being used in shared mode and the caller asked to use the device in exclusive mode".


Nice caveat: That makes exclusive mode utterly useless
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby MrDowntempo » Fri May 05, 2017 7:35 am

Absolutely lovely release!

Are QZDOOM and GZDOOMGPL done and no longer needed now, or will they have other reasons to exist?

Since there's a lot of talk about audio in here, has anyone looked at https://valvesoftware.github.io/steam-audio/ as a possible replacement audio system? It's not GPL, but it does have an openAPI
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby Graf Zahl » Fri May 05, 2017 7:49 am

No source release means that thing is worthless. The license also poses a problem.
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby camaxide » Tue May 09, 2017 2:21 pm

Ah, it seems OpenAl now correctly plays back sounds even if you place a stereo-sound to play as a mono, so it no longer breaks my mod. I noticed you killed FModEx with 3.0 and imagined I had to explort, re-code to mono and re-import all my custom sounds - but luckily I no longer need to do that job.. I've started making all new sounds Mono though... :)
It's better to have one sound-option than two as long as that one works well for all mods. that way you know what sounds will play like, as not 50% of the people playing your mod will sit using a different sound-engine. :)
I'll tell if I notice any struggle with music - I had quite some work making that play well in the new fmodex but finally got it working recently - but first quick test seemed all good with OpenAl
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby BFeely » Sat May 13, 2017 2:26 pm

Hi. You have an outdated sentence in the /about page:
ZDoom ports may be used and distributed free of charge. No profit may be made from the sale of it.

This is of course now no longer true with GZDoom 3.0.0 and newer, as the GPL license allows for limited commercial use of the code.

camaxide wrote:Ah, it seems OpenAl now correctly plays back sounds even if you place a stereo-sound to play as a mono, so it no longer breaks my mod. I noticed you killed FModEx with 3.0 and imagined I had to explort, re-code to mono and re-import all my custom sounds - but luckily I no longer need to do that job.. I've started making all new sounds Mono though... :)
It's better to have one sound-option than two as long as that one works well for all mods. that way you know what sounds will play like, as not 50% of the people playing your mod will sit using a different sound-engine. :)
I'll tell if I notice any struggle with music - I had quite some work making that play well in the new fmodex but finally got it working recently - but first quick test seemed all good with OpenAl

Killing off FMOD was due to the license change; the GZDoom project could no longer legally use FMOD as a result.
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby Gez » Sat May 13, 2017 3:22 pm

FMOD's days were numbered anyway. Firelight went from FMOD to FMOD Ex to FMOD Studio to whatever is the next, and even then they didn't bother about keeping a compatible API/ABI. For example for a while ZDoom's water reverb implementation was broken if you used the latest versions of FMOD Ex. We've seen that on the wiki: for a while we could just keep a template link to the latest version of FMOD Ex up-to-date, then we had to check that it still compiled and worked with ZDoom correctly, and eventually we got stuck with an outdated FMOD that we even had to rehost ourselves because it was no longer available on Firelight's site... Nah. It's just not something that we could keep using. The license change merely hastened the inevitable.
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Re: GZDoom 3.0.0 Released

Postby Graf Zahl » Sat May 13, 2017 4:35 pm

And let's not forget that at some point they added mandatory registration for downloading their SDK.
Oh, of course they still continue to add breaking changes to their API. The only reason why it hadn't been replaced earlier was some borderline irrational dislike for OpenAL on Randi's part.

On the other hand, OpenAL Soft's developer is an active member here at the forum - which is going to help both projects. And with a fixed API/ABI it will hopefully be possible for a long time to just replace the DLL even for older GZDoom versions if some underlying change requires it. Also quite contrary to FMod. FMod 3.75, which has been used for many years is totally broken on my system with bottom-of-the-barrel sound quality. I have to stat all older ZDooms with -nosound if I want to test something in there.
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