[ZETH] 2004-11-02 edition

[Chris]

Well, here's a treat for you all.. I decided I couldn't leave it well-enough alone, and that I didn't want my last changes to go un-appreciated. I fixed up the code a touch, added a Premake script, and packaged it together. I can't tell you what bugs are still there because I can't remember. But there's two things I remember adding that's worth mentioning here:

• Free-draw mode. Press ctrl+shift+d to activate it. Right click to select an existing vertex and start building a sector there, or else use left click to create a new vertex to start. Continue along, left clicking on each vertex position (including existing ones), then right click on the starting vertex. This mode does not do line-tracing, so if you don't make sure to close the sector, it will be improperly made.
• Decorate Items. I hacked together a decorate parser (emphasis on hack) so objects defined in DECORATE lumps will be put into the item list.

ZETH still overwrites the target map file, so be careful not to save it as that multi-lump resource WAD you have saved. It will be ungraciously overwritten if you do. I also took the liberty of adding the two new stacked sector special things to thingz.cfg. Feel free to use them.

Oh yes.. it requires Allegro 4.1.16 or later, libpng, and zlib to build. With any luck, it'll build on both Windows and Linux.

EDIT: May 2nd 2005, Windows binaries available: http://rapidshare.de/files/1532698/zeth ... 2.zip.html

[Chris]

Hmm.. surprised this hasn't been stickied...

[Macil]

What's Zeth? And how do i use it? No EXE's, no BAT's, no Java CLASS's...

[Graf Zahl]

You have to compile it yourself. That's what happens if some Linux users develop software. Apparently they don't even consider providing binaries for all those people who

a) don't use Linux or
b) don't know how to compile stuff.

Anyway, if you don't know what to do with it better stick with DoomBuilder to make your levels.


And one thing that annoys even me: Why tar.bz2? That is one of those compression formats I have no decent tools for and have to dig out some shit I don't like. Is it really too much to ask to use something more common (like .zip or .tar.gz) that every decent compression manager can handle? Who cares about those few kilobytes that are saved by it?

[Chris]

You have to compile it yourself. That's what happens if some Linux users develop software. Apparently they don't even consider providing binaries for all those people who

a) don't use Linux or
b) don't know how to compile stuff.

It's kind of hard to provide Windows binaries when I don't have Windows. Point me to a good cross-compiler and a reliable means to test Windows programs in Linux, and I'll gladly do it.

And if anyone else is willing to compile and package a Windows executable, go right ahead. I encourage it.

And one thing that annoys even me: Why tar.bz2? That is one of those compression formats I have no decent tools for and have to dig out some shit I don't like. Is it really too much to ask to use something more common (like .zip or .tar.gz) that every decent compression manager can handle? Who cares about those few kilobytes that are saved by it?

bz2 isn't standard? I don't ever remember having a problem with it.. both WinRAR and 7-Zip handled it fine in Windows. I'm surprised you don't say the same thing about Randy using cabs: That is one of those compression formats I have no decent tools for and have to dig out some shit I don't like. Is it really too much to ask to use something more common (like .zip or .tar.gz) that every decent compression manager can handle?

Oh, but wait.. you can browse it like a normal folder as long as you use Windows. That makes it alll better.

Personally, I don't like .zip. It doesn't support one critical feature: global compression. It just compresses the individual files and packs them together, instead of packing the files and then compressing them together.

[NiGHTMARE]

I thought that pretty much every program which can handle .zip, can also handle .cab?

[Chris]

Things work differently in Linux. In Linux, you pretty much have a single program for a single thing. zip is handled by one program, tar is by another, gz yet another, bz2 has a seperate handler, and cab another. Some of them (like tar) can automatically call bzip2 or gzip, and other programs can tie a bunch together. But you still need something to extract cabs, and it's not a standard format to easilly find something. Cabs are really only used for Windows stuff.. not user programs.

[Graf Zahl]

I thought that pretty much every program which can handle .zip, can also handle .cab?

Exactly! But the same isn't true for .bz2 and I have to resort to tools I really don't like.

[Graf Zahl]

Oh, but wait.. you can browse it like a normal folder as long as you use Windows. That makes it alll better.

Bingo!

Things work differently in Linux. In Linux, you pretty much have a single program for a single thing. zip is handled by one program, tar is by another, gz yet another, bz2 has a seperate handler, and cab another. Some of them (like tar) can automatically call bzip2 or gzip, and other programs can tie a bunch together. But you still need something to extract cabs, and it's not a standard format to easilly find something. Cabs are really only used for Windows stuff.. not user programs.

Well, then Linux sucks! Forcing the user to do stuff with command line tools that he should never do in such an uncomfortable fashion won't particularly help to elevate Linux from its freak status.

[Macil]

What do I need? WatCom? I think that's what I need. Is ZDooM source also compilable with WatCom? Or is there an old freeware Visual C that microsoft is distrubiting that i can use?

[Chris]

I use GCC. If you use Windows, MinGW is the GCC port of choice.

Well, then Linux sucks! Forcing the user to do stuff with command line tools that he should never do in such an uncomfortable fashion won't particularly help to elevate Linux from its freak status.

Did I say it forces the user to do command-line stuff? No.. I even said that there are programs that tie them all together for you. But they don't come with their own implementations of archive (de)compression routines.. it uses the command line tools you already have (saves on disk space, keeps incompatibilities down, and makes it so every compressor is just as good as the original tool). But .cab is not standard, so most people who don't use Windows have to search to find something to extract it with.

[MasterOFDeath]

What's Zeth? And how do i use it? No EXE's, no BAT's, no Java CLASS's...

ZETH is a DETH based ZDoom editor.

You have to compile it yourself. That's what happens if some Linux users develop software. Apparently they don't even consider providing binaries for all those people who

a) don't use Linux or
b) don't know how to compile stuff.

It's kind of hard to provide Windows binaries when I don't have Windows. Point me to a good cross-compiler and a reliable means to test Windows programs in Linux, and I'll gladly do it.

And if anyone else is willing to compile and package a Windows executable, go right ahead. I encourage it.

He is right Graf, dont flame him about things he has no control over.

As for compression stuff, I remember way back when I used winzip, it wouldn't open cabs, windows would. So much stuff is made for windows that it makes people who use an os such as Linux suffer. From what I have heard, Linux is not bad, its bascially just windows with different file handling.

As for this ZETH version, would someone please compile a windows binary? I would but im lazy and I lack the knowledge of this kind of stuff.

[Graf Zahl]

WinZip is a piece of shit so don't use it as a base for comparison. Too bad everbody uses it...

[NiGHTMARE]

Winzip has been able to open cabs since the earliest versions. IMHO it's better than those POS programs WinAce and WinRAR, which can't even remember the last directory you extracted to (which sounds fairly minor, but it's actually bloody annoying).

[TheDarkArchon]

WinRAR is a zombieman!!! That's news to me.