[WIP] Caronte 2015 - Beta 2 Posted

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BiyuFG
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[WIP] Caronte 2015 - Beta 2 Posted

Post by BiyuFG »

UPDATE: Beta 2. Feedback welcome!

Hello! First post here (or anywhere in the Doom community, actually) and I've been wondering for a while if this was a good idea, given the high quality of the projects that are released for ZDoom. But what the hell, why not...

So, first a small introduction.

From 1994 to 1998, me and my homies loved mapping for Doom and the rest of the Doom engine games. Having no online access, we got several mapping and WAD-tinkering applications from magazine cover CDs (does anyone remember those?) and we would churn out mediocre levels by the dozen, mostly to share with each other and with our high school classmates and friends. We had so many maps that we actually made a megawad called Caronte (Spanish for "Charon"), full with maps of questionable quality that we still loved to death and that few people outside our neighborhood ever played.

Skip to late 2014, twenty years (oh, God, twenty years) later, a couple of weeks ago, when I find an old backup with this megawad and several other maps me and my friends made, and I have the stupid idea of giving the ten best maps a bit of a facelift (nothing too crazy), re-balancing them and, why not, publishing them for the first time ever.

So this is mostly a vanity project for nostalgia's sake and because I wanted people to finally see how we wasted our teenage years instead of going out and getting laid. Don't expect anything ground-breaking, but don't expect square rooms joined by hallways either. Expect old-style gameplay. Whenever I has to choose between completely changing the layout of a map or being faithful to the original, I chose the latter. Whenever I could easily replace some mapping trick with a sleaker and simpler script, I chose not to.

I think these maps are, at the very least, amusing and entertaining in an old school way. I hope you feel the same or at the very least that they make you smile.


So, for the proof that this is a thing...
Spoiler:

The whole thing is playable already, but I'd like to add some more extra detailing without getting too baroque, trying to respect the spirit of the original maps. And of course, and most important, I'd like to fine tune the gameplay as much as possible. Just because this is a self-gratifying project it doesn't mean it has to be half-assed, right?

I shall be posting more pics, betas, updates, and whatever. And taking your constructive criticism and multiple suggestions to go home and find a new hobby, of course! :)
Last edited by BiyuFG on Wed Oct 29, 2014 6:55 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Gez
 
 
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by Gez »

Screenshots look nice enough, except for the blue things in the eighth image, the one with the cacos. What's going on there? Is it a sky texture seen through a window? The shape is a bit odd for that.
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Sgt. Shivers
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by Sgt. Shivers »

It's nice to see "Classic" projects like this here!
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revo794
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by revo794 »

Looks really 90s-ish indeed, just as I like. Looking forward to it!
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BiyuFG
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by BiyuFG »

Gez wrote:Screenshots look nice enough, except for the blue things in the eighth image, the one with the cacos. What's going on there? Is it a sky texture seen through a window? The shape is a bit odd for that.
Oh, that. I've been playing around with the SetFader options. I might just get rid of it.
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BiyuFG
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by BiyuFG »

Okay, so this is more or less what I'm going for.

Before:

Image

After:

Image

It's subtle, I know. The "after" picture is basically what I remember I originally tried to have this hallway look like, before I gave up because of the completely unexplained "sector not closed" errors my good ol' DCK kept throwing at me.

I'm not planning to detail the rooms much more, at the moment. I'd like to play a bit more with light levels and I think the floor in that second picture looks a bit too bland, but I'm noit planning to go crazy. The only exception is MAP06, that was originally intended to be the first map of a Terminator TC and that I've redesigned using many more advanced features because, well... it's what I always dreamed it would look like.

Still, I'm slightly worried about "coomunity standards" here; I'm silly, I know, but I don't want to release some crappy 1990s maps for an advanced port and become the laughingstock. :lol: So, do you think this is enough?
Gez
 
 
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by Gez »

As long as the maps are fun to play... Crazy sector detailing isn't necessarily good. (In fact, I think you could remove half of the ceiling lights in that corridor and it'd look better, for example; give the remaining lamps more room to breathe so to speak.)
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BiyuFG
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by BiyuFG »

Good call.
Nevander
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by Nevander »

Dude, this looks awesome. This to me looks like a classic IWAD-style mapset. The screenshots look great and the level design in them so far is pretty good. It's not too complex and not so simple to the point it looks 1994-ish. I'd say you're on the right track with this. I'm looking forward to the final product for sure. I myself am working on my own megawad and you just gave me encouragement to keep going on my own project with even more enthusiasm.

Even without playing it, I would give this a 4.9/5. I can't add that 0.1 until I play it, but right now you can pretty much say I'm a fan. I'm a sucker for classic style levels with all the vanilla aspects.
osjclatchford
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by osjclatchford »

no beta dl ?

looks great! is it fully vanilla or has it new monsters and weapons (I hope not) :wink:
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BiyuFG
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by BiyuFG »

It actually has new monsters, and that's the main reason it's a ZDoom project and not a Vanilla/Chocolate one: the DECORATE support.

This project is a recreation of a twenty-year old series of maps and a couple of those used DeHackED patches to do some weird stuff with their beasts. Patches that are basically incompatible between them and with the vanilla monsters, so I'm esentially rebuilding those monsters on DECORATE.

It's nothing too massive or game-breaking: the Terminator inspired map originally had silent plasma-shooting imps, so I'm replacing those with a plasma soldier based on the one in the Realm667 Beastiary but with altered behavior to fit with my original DeHackED beast. This plasma soldier also makes appearances in a couple of other maps, for coherence and to help with the learning curve. There's also a very silly subtype of zombieman in one of the secret maps but, hey, it's a secret map. :P

I did consider adding new weapons, as the original 1998 map pack had some of those again via DeHackED, but they weren't really that good to begin with and the effort to make them balanced probably isn't worth it. I loathe messing with the perfection that's Doom 2's set of weapons, truth be told. I considered adding one to one of the secret levels as an easter egg and a reward for finding them, but once again: not worth the effort.

Also, the last map is a conversion of a Hexen map (it's the only "final boss" map we built that was worth anything), so I'm adding some kind of final bosses to replace Korax (thinking of some kind of Iron Lich variant, as I always thought that with the right color palette they were creepy enough for Doom) and the Heresiarch (probably just a stronger Baron of Hell kind of monster). We originally had sprite sets for several of the new monsters and weapons we created, but they were all lost in a hard drive crash and I don't really want to ask the original artist (now a graphic artist for a living) to redraw them, so I'm limited to my own very limited spriting abilities and to using existing community monsters. Same with the textures. A real pity but well, it's what I have to work with.


Thanks for the support, everyone. I'll be posting a demo of the first five levels in the foreseeable future. :)
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BiyuFG
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by BiyuFG »

So here's the first beta! Ten levels, plus two secret levels, completely playable from beginning to end (although some of the maps have been finished in a hurry to have something to show here, especially MAP01 and MAP06).

This is obviously a work in progress, of course, doesn't represent the objective of this little project, and a lot of work still needs to be done. I suspect several rooms are going to end up excised for being excessively derivative of maps we liked back then and replaced by new (and hopefully more original) material. This version doesn't have the new music, either, so the soundtrack is a half-assed selection of Doom 2 tracks; this means the boss music is never played but oh well, it's a beta after all. The titlepic is also little more than a placeholder. The final boss sprites might end up changing. A lot of attribution needs to be given. And so on.

Still! Some feedback and brutal criticism would be more than welcome. Hence, this beta.


Download link (EDIT: Updated link)
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BiyuFG
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015 - Beta 1 Posted

Post by BiyuFG »

No feedback, I see. Ah well. I'm still going at it.

Here's a second beta. Now with cluster definitions, some changes here and there, and a much better experience in general.

Download link
PFL
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015

Post by PFL »

Nevander wrote:Even without playing it, I would give this a 4.9/5. I can't add that 0.1 until I play it,
:roll: If you ever get a phone call with a Caribbean cruise line win, don't send money.

About the wad itself, this actually is a mix bag for me. While some parts look awesome and play great, others don't. Caronte Lab was impossible for me (why the yellow keycard permanent trap ?) while Pale Rider is HUGE of emptyness; loaded with empty no purpose areas. Also many weird designed areas.

I'm going for the 7th now and I felt the presence of 31 & 32 lurking nearby ...
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BiyuFG
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Re: [WIP] Caronte 2015 - Beta 2 Posted

Post by BiyuFG »

Pale Rider comes from a completely different project (an aborted Terminator TC) with a very different intended gameplay and atmosphere, and it probably shows. Anything you would think would improve it? I actually considered turning it into a secret level, as I did with the other two, er, "different" maps.

The yellow keycard trap in Caronte Lab actually goes up once you kill all of the imps in the room, via a small script. The original version had that "bars fall for 5 minutes and then get up" thing, but my friends used to find it boring. Is it buggy? If people find the version with the script confusing, I'll simply remove the trap and leave it as a simple ambush. I'd rather have a simpler encounter than something that makes people quit the map.

Thanks for the feedback! It's extremely useful.
Last edited by BiyuFG on Wed Oct 29, 2014 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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