Six Ways to Die

For in-development or completed ZDoom projects
Forum rules
Got a cool project idea but nothing else? This forum is NOT for you! Put it in this thread instead!
Please read the full rules for more details.

Six Ways to Die

Postby ReX » Tue Dec 27, 2011 1:27 pm

Six Ways to Die is a two-map mod for GZDooM that extensively features functional 3D architecture and fierce fighting.

The first map, Six Ways to Die, has finely balanced ammo and health at UV skill. Cautious playing is recommended; if all else fails, use the berserk you get at the start. Find all 6 secrets to access the Super Secret Level. [Refer to the file named secrets.txt]

The second map, Palais des Cauchemars, has a good amount of ammo and health, but monster-infighting is strongly encouraged. It's easy to use ammo unnecessarily and find your weapon chamber empty at UV skill.

Screenshots

Text File

Download Zip File

Best wishes for 2012.
User avatar
ReX
Title? I don't need no steenkin' title!
 
Joined: 05 Aug 2003
Location: Quatto's Palace

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby Caleb13 » Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:12 pm

Wow, after some time, it is so good to see a map that doesn't use bazillion new monsters or weapon mods. I was really looking forward to play something like this. It is very nice job as usual, but... isn't it waste to hide MAP32 as secret? In my opinion, it is much more impressive and playable than the base "six ways to die" map...
Caleb13
Death will not be your end; your soul will burn in Hell forever!
 
Joined: 30 Jun 2010

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby ReX » Wed Dec 28, 2011 11:01 am

Caleb13 wrote:.....isn't it waste to hide MAP32 as secret?

I tend to agree with you. However, most players who are interested in playing Map32 will warp to it even if they don't "find the super secret exit".
User avatar
ReX
Title? I don't need no steenkin' title!
 
Joined: 05 Aug 2003
Location: Quatto's Palace

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby darkhaven3 » Wed Dec 28, 2011 12:36 pm

It's not a great release. Both maps are really weird and gimmicky, and I unfortunately just didn't enjoy myself that much. The gameplay leaves alot to be desired (being attacked by 10 cacodemons with barely any room to maneuver is not what I call "fun", and neither is being trapped in a tiny room with 6 Pain Elementals). The maps themselves are frankly pretty ugly, and they come off as "TPD 2" to me.

These are all screenshots of areas that really caught my attention as lacking or particularly unattractive.

There was some legitimate effort put into a few scarce areas here and there, but otherwise everything is either bland or gaudy.
User avatar
darkhaven3
nigga please
 
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Location: San Diego, CA

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby Enjay » Wed Dec 28, 2011 3:15 pm

Had it not been for your screenshots, I wouldn't be convinced that we were even playing the same maps. I thoroughly enjoyed them, and although some of the areas you screenshoted are a little plain or have texture "wallpapering" (something that we already know Rex is happy with) others are areas where I stopped and thought "cool". I certainly wouldn't class the maps as ugly and, in fact, I thought that there were some areas that were really nice looking.

Sure, Six Ways in particular was centred around a gimmick but, for me, the main "gimmick" was that I thought 3D floors had been used just as naturally as if they had always been in the game and were part of traditional Doom gameplay.

Imagine that, darkhaven disliking some Rex maps and Enjay liking the very same maps. This is becoming a habit. ;)
User avatar
Enjay
Everyone is a moon, and has a dark side which he never shows to anybody. Twain
 
Joined: 15 Jul 2003
Location: Scotland

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby darkhaven3 » Wed Dec 28, 2011 8:13 pm

Enjay, if you would please actually read my post, you would notice that I did not at any point address ReX's "wallpaper texturing". I think you're just trying to stir up shit to make me look bad, and I will not have it. ;) I brought up the gameplay first and foremost, and you failed to address any of my points.

Again, please read my posts before responding to them.


On an ironic note, maybe I should actually read people's posts more thoroughly before responding to them! Sorry for the false accusations, I pretty much completely misinterpreted you. Though my points on gameplay have not been addressed, that is another matter entirely over me misinterpreting your post.
User avatar
darkhaven3
nigga please
 
Joined: 05 Jan 2004
Location: San Diego, CA

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby esselfortium » Wed Dec 28, 2011 8:27 pm

The biggest thing that stands out to me in many of the pictures, both on ReX's site and in Darkhaven's link, is that the color coordination is rather lacking IMO. Eriance discussed this some in the release thread for The Phobos Directive.

For the sake of simplicity I'm going to forgo any other things I could bring up for now and just make a mention of that: The ways that green, gray, tan, brown, and most particularly the heavily saturated reds and blues are mixed together rather haphazardly in a single scene like this just makes things seem garish and unfocused to me.

While I'm not terribly keen on the gray* and modwall* stuff in this scene, the colors and shades are mostly more subdued, better organized, and complement each other better even with the bright red sky still there, and the scene as a whole looks infinitely better to me as a result. (It could use some lighting variation though ;))

Paying more careful attention to not only the colors you're using but also the ways they're arranged together is an effective way to make even very simple scenes look attractive and coherent.
User avatar
esselfortium
A Birdcage Until Further Notice
 
Joined: 19 Sep 2006

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby PFL » Wed Dec 28, 2011 9:04 pm

Hey Rex, this wad was HARD man. Had a nightmare Christmas so everybody will pay? :twisted: So, you'll probably want to change that name to a hundred ways to die... and the palace is great looking too.
PFL
 
Joined: 28 Jul 2008
Location: .ca

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby Enjay » Thu Dec 29, 2011 6:02 am

@darkhaven
The only reason I mentioned "wallpapering" was because it was evident in some of your screenshots. I know that you didn't raise it explicitly but I assumed (incorrectly?) that wallpapering was at least a contributory factor in why you thought those particular areas were ugly.

The main reason I didn't focus much on gameplay (though I did touch on it very lightly and very briefly) was that I'd actually posted my opinions on it over at Rex's DRD thread and, although I know not everyone from here goes there, I couldn't be bothered repeating myself - even by simply pasting a link or copy pasting. :P

http://forum.drdteam.org/viewtopic.php? ... 539#p51539

Suffice to say, I was very positive about the maps - including areas that you think are weaknesses - so I'm sure we would still not reach agreement on them. ;) I certainly wasn't trying to shit stir or make you look bad. We have different opinions on the maps and that's fine. :)
User avatar
Enjay
Everyone is a moon, and has a dark side which he never shows to anybody. Twain
 
Joined: 15 Jul 2003
Location: Scotland

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby ReX » Thu Dec 29, 2011 11:56 am

darkhaven3 wrote:....being attacked by 10 cacodemons with barely any room to maneuver is not what I call "fun", and neither is being trapped in a tiny room with 6 Pain Elementals).

Curiously, the limited room to maneuver (coupled with the tight ammo situation) is what made the cacodemon/lava arena challenging and fun for me. Cacodemons are typically relatively easy enemies to deal with, but when they swarm in tight places they can be tough opponents. Even though I normally tire of the gameplay in my own levels after constantly play-testing them, I have to say (without trying to be immodest) that I continue to enjoy the unpredictability of the fights in Six Ways to Die, even after running through them dozens of times.

As for the six Pain Elementals, I assume you're referring to those in the exit area in Palais des Cauchemars. None of them is flagged "deaf", which means that there is virtually no chance of you "being trapped in a tiny room with" them. As soon as you begin the fight in the final hall they'll hear you and leave the exit area to investigate. Even if you don't fire a shot to alert them, you'll still have to reach the throne platform to press the switch to open the exit door, they'll see you and you come out to investigate. The only way they'll still be in the exit area is if you grab the invulnerability, run around to the throne platforms and press the switch, and rush through the exit door before they swarm to block it. By that time you can simply cross the exit line and not have to deal with them at all. In other words, the only way you'll be trapped with them is if you deliberately do so, or for some reason you choose not to exit when you get through the exit door. [In fact, when I was testing that area I deliberately ran to the far corner of the exit room repeatedly and battled it out with the Pain elementals to see if it was possible to win. Most of the time I found that I could defeat them but there'd be barons entering the area that made it extremely difficult to completely clear the area and get some breathing room before venturing back to the main hall.] In other words, in the course of "normal" gameplay, it's highly improbable that you'll end up being trapped in that room with them.

These are all screenshots of areas that really caught my attention as lacking or particularly unattractive.

I agree that some areas, such as this one are very plain. Overall, however, I am satisfied with the level of detail and texturing in the maps.

esselfortium wrote:The biggest thing that stands out to me in many of the pictures, both on ReX's site and in Darkhaven's link, is that the color coordination is rather lacking IMO.... The ways that green, gray, tan, brown, and most particularly the heavily saturated reds and blues are mixed together rather haphazardly in a single scene like this just makes things seem garish and unfocused to me.

Although you may not agree with my choices, I want to mention that I spend quite a bit of time making texture selections that do, in my opinion, complement each other. In other words, I never randomly or haphazardly choose textures and flats. That you do not like my choices is your prerogative; for my part I am usually very satisfied with the final appearance. Perhaps I lack an artistic bent of mind, and perhaps if someone else were to redo an area I have created I might see an improvement, but when I release a map I genuinely believe that I have fulfilled my own "vision" of it.

PFL wrote:Hey Rex, this wad was HARD man. Had a nightmare Christmas so everybody will pay? :twisted: So, you'll probably want to change that name to a hundred ways to die... and the palace is great looking too.

Yes, I agree that these maps are quite difficult for the average player (which is what I am) at UV skill. However, I have generally provided a back door for the fights (including allowing monster infighting) and have repeteadly tested the fights to make sure that an average player has a chance of succeeding. That's not to say that the player is guaranteed to succeed every time (what would be the fun in that, no?), but the player has the opportunity to discover what works best for their style of playing.

At HMP skill I find most fights to be quite easy. But at UV skill there is not much room for error, and it requires some degree of luck.
User avatar
ReX
Title? I don't need no steenkin' title!
 
Joined: 05 Aug 2003
Location: Quatto's Palace

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby PFL » Thu Dec 29, 2011 8:16 pm

Yes. The Revenants attacking and spawning while The Cybermastermind shoot like crazy and, why not, an Archvile flamming the hell out of it when you try to run away! in some water slow down process path. OUF!. Then there is this circle clear platform where you need to survive... These are, if not, the toughest maps you released. And I say this as a hardcore Doomer. It was fun, challenging and don't bother the theory about mixing colours/textures or anything else; some people tend to think this is a scientific debate with ONE way to go. :sadno:
PFL
 
Joined: 28 Jul 2008
Location: .ca

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby ReX » Thu Dec 29, 2011 9:28 pm

PFL wrote:The Revenants attacking and spawning while The Cybermastermind shoot like crazy...

There is a way to gain an unintended advantage in this area. If you kill off the revenants and not bother with the Spider Mastermind, pretty soon you'll get a fresh bulk cell pack and some revenants to deal with (3 of them at UV). The new ammo is more than enough to deal with the revenants, and then you can wait a bit longer, get fresh ammo, and so on. Pretty soon you'll be loaded up with cells, which you can use to finish up all enemies in the area and have some left over for other areas. To truly challenge myself, I have occasionally run into the domed area with the Spider Demon, circle-strafed (or taken cover behind the switch pillar) and attacked until it is dead, and then gone out to take care of the revenants and the archvile. Most times I die an ugly and untimely death (not least because I take a revenant rocket to the back), but on a few occasions I've survived with virtually no ammo and precariously low health.

Then there is this circle clear platform where you need to survive...

The best way I figured out for this fight is to only attack the chaingunner after the first switch, then run from switch to switch to release enemies that will likely attack each other. In that way you don't actually have to stand and fight any of them, and you save all your ammo for the later part. [Occasionally, you'll need to fend off attacks from the cacodemons that are released after the second switch, but you have plenty of room to maneuver and a fair number of rockets with which to toast them.] After that, you need to take care when you release the archvile, because the force-fields do not protect you; all you really have for cover are the narrow pillars. But I've found that I'll generally get lucky and the archvile will try to resurrect a dead enemy before turning its attention to me, and while it's doing that I'll blast away with a concentrated salvo of rockets.

As I mentioned above, I think there is an element of unpredictability to these maps that add another layer of challenge. I did not set out to deliberately make the levels difficult, but I agree that it's how they turned out. [On one play through, the final enemy count was 821 because of Pain Elemental spawning of Lost Souls in the final area. Thankfully, their attention was mostly directed at the cyberdemon on the throne platform.]
User avatar
ReX
Title? I don't need no steenkin' title!
 
Joined: 05 Aug 2003
Location: Quatto's Palace

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby PFL » Fri Dec 30, 2011 7:50 am

You described what I did. A protected Me to fight the Motherspider, then the rest. But that was the second time. On the first try, I got shot in the back while I was WALKING SLOW for cover in the water (damn boots). And I did the exact same thing as you mentioned for the circling switches. Was a hard run. You should consider making a Megawad out of all your maps; could be really good.
PFL
 
Joined: 28 Jul 2008
Location: .ca

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby Caleb13 » Fri Dec 30, 2011 5:19 pm

PFL wrote:You should consider making a Megawad out of all your maps; could be really good.


Ohh yes, I would love to see that happen, too!
Caleb13
Death will not be your end; your soul will burn in Hell forever!
 
Joined: 30 Jun 2010

Re: Six Ways to Die

Postby wildweasel » Fri Dec 30, 2011 6:38 pm

I would honestly love to see a retake on the concept behind Temple of the Ancients, but with a bit more depth to the different areas of the hub, perhaps special "weapons" that would be required to access certain areas, Castlevania-style.
User avatar
wildweasel
shinier. toastier.
 
Joined: 15 Jul 2003
Location: amurrika. *fires a shotgun into the air*

Next

Return to Projects

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: D00mfan, scalliano and 11 guests